HW News - Intel Changes Its Change, Microcode Update, Corsair Struggles, & Google Monopoly
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Date: 2024-08-12
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Comments and reviews: 20
brotherwulfgar
This is coming from somebody who used to be a loyal corsair guy, having moved on to better hardware last year and realizing just how much corsair has been gapped by its competitors:
Corsair hasn’t really improved on anything for the last few years either, while other peripheral and case manufacturers are releasing exciting new shit. They’re outclassed in mice at the same pricepoints, they’re outclassed in keyboards, their PSUs haven’t seen many discounts lately and there are equally protective or better-protecting PSUs that got released recently that undercut Corsair by $10-$30 and when you’re on a budget, that’s a meaningful difference. Their PC case designs don’t vary much and haven’t improved much either, although their traditional ATX mesh cases do offer some of the best airflow you can get. Unfortunately they only cater to one taste in appearance and Fractal Design, etc, has been on a roll with their cases, plus they released the Pop Air which is considerably cheaper and a bit neater looking. Corsair needs to start up its R&D again and get to releasing some competitive hardware that people can get excited about.
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This is coming from somebody who used to be a loyal corsair guy, having moved on to better hardware last year and realizing just how much corsair has been gapped by its competitors:
Corsair hasn’t really improved on anything for the last few years either, while other peripheral and case manufacturers are releasing exciting new shit. They’re outclassed in mice at the same pricepoints, they’re outclassed in keyboards, their PSUs haven’t seen many discounts lately and there are equally protective or better-protecting PSUs that got released recently that undercut Corsair by $10-$30 and when you’re on a budget, that’s a meaningful difference. Their PC case designs don’t vary much and haven’t improved much either, although their traditional ATX mesh cases do offer some of the best airflow you can get. Unfortunately they only cater to one taste in appearance and Fractal Design, etc, has been on a roll with their cases, plus they released the Pop Air which is considerably cheaper and a bit neater looking. Corsair needs to start up its R&D again and get to releasing some competitive hardware that people can get excited about.
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shodan6401
Tests of the new Microcode reveal that Single and Dual Core Boost STILL receive as much as 1.44v, more or less depending on the CPU, and STILL degrade your chip. BUT, it lowers System Idle voltage, even for Max Power Plans that are supposed to maintain high frequencies at all times.
The idea is that degradation will occur more slowly over time, allowing the processor to survive the warranty period.
This will not be true for CPUs deployed in Server style environments, where demand on the processor is constant.
It remains true that the ONLY valid way to protect your CPU is to Synch all cores and adjust frequency and voltage so all-core voltage is around 1.35v, allowing for overshoot.
Definitely disable all Single and Dual Core Boost behavior, unless you don't care if your CPU eventually fails or must be significantly down-clocked just to continue running.
This has been the Fix since the beginning, and nothing has changed with the latest update. Intel only cares about Warranty replacement, they don't care about you or your CPU.
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Tests of the new Microcode reveal that Single and Dual Core Boost STILL receive as much as 1.44v, more or less depending on the CPU, and STILL degrade your chip. BUT, it lowers System Idle voltage, even for Max Power Plans that are supposed to maintain high frequencies at all times.
The idea is that degradation will occur more slowly over time, allowing the processor to survive the warranty period.
This will not be true for CPUs deployed in Server style environments, where demand on the processor is constant.
It remains true that the ONLY valid way to protect your CPU is to Synch all cores and adjust frequency and voltage so all-core voltage is around 1.35v, allowing for overshoot.
Definitely disable all Single and Dual Core Boost behavior, unless you don't care if your CPU eventually fails or must be significantly down-clocked just to continue running.
This has been the Fix since the beginning, and nothing has changed with the latest update. Intel only cares about Warranty replacement, they don't care about you or your CPU.
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nighty7158
Corsair felt themselves to be premium, and changed their prices to fit this belief - just.. their competition didn't stand still, and Corsair soon looked like the one standing still.
Their RAM are mostly all overpriced, and their timings are that of budget RAM - with premium prices.
Their cases are fine - but, the competition just offer excellent cases for less money, or with a more premium feel - such as the North or so.
Their peripherals are just overpriced.
Their AIOs are nothing special - and you can get better performance for half the price (Arctic).
Their fans are just silly expensive, and even as a massive cooling nerd/poweruser.. I'd never pay that for their fans. Not to mention - for the same price the competition got LCD screens in their fans. Gimmick, but still.
Their PSUs are fine - just expensive.
Etc. Etc.
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Corsair felt themselves to be premium, and changed their prices to fit this belief - just.. their competition didn't stand still, and Corsair soon looked like the one standing still.
Their RAM are mostly all overpriced, and their timings are that of budget RAM - with premium prices.
Their cases are fine - but, the competition just offer excellent cases for less money, or with a more premium feel - such as the North or so.
Their peripherals are just overpriced.
Their AIOs are nothing special - and you can get better performance for half the price (Arctic).
Their fans are just silly expensive, and even as a massive cooling nerd/poweruser.. I'd never pay that for their fans. Not to mention - for the same price the competition got LCD screens in their fans. Gimmick, but still.
Their PSUs are fine - just expensive.
Etc. Etc.
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mickleman52
Can someone explain to me why mobile CPUs are not effected by the intel issues From everything that has come out recently (microcode & oxidation), I don't really see how mobile CPUs wouldn't be effected in someway. Is the microcode for mobile CPUs different from desktop Is there something different about mobile architecture/how laptops handle power delivery that would prevent the microcode bug Similarly in regards to the oxidation, I had always assumed the manufacturing process for mobile vs desktop was the same, so wouldn't the same defects potentially occur on both
If mobile is excluded from all these issues, fantastic. However, all the reporting I have seem (GN, J2C, LTT, etc.) has made it pretty clear these issues effect all 13th and 14th gen chips.
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Can someone explain to me why mobile CPUs are not effected by the intel issues From everything that has come out recently (microcode & oxidation), I don't really see how mobile CPUs wouldn't be effected in someway. Is the microcode for mobile CPUs different from desktop Is there something different about mobile architecture/how laptops handle power delivery that would prevent the microcode bug Similarly in regards to the oxidation, I had always assumed the manufacturing process for mobile vs desktop was the same, so wouldn't the same defects potentially occur on both
If mobile is excluded from all these issues, fantastic. However, all the reporting I have seem (GN, J2C, LTT, etc.) has made it pretty clear these issues effect all 13th and 14th gen chips.
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mithos16
Regarding Corsair while their idea of a broad, unified product stack supported by one software is in general a good idea, the execution simply just sucks.
iCue is beyond garbage, their hardware products are overpriced and the quality is just bad. I had to make that experience first hand when I built a PC in 2020 and equipped it with RGB Fans where the LEDs started to malfunction after about a year. Then there is the wireless headset where the already abysmally low range got reduced even more after a firmware update.
The only positive experience I had with Corsair is their keyboards (K100) and the things that dont do anything like their headset stand or mousepad
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Regarding Corsair while their idea of a broad, unified product stack supported by one software is in general a good idea, the execution simply just sucks.
iCue is beyond garbage, their hardware products are overpriced and the quality is just bad. I had to make that experience first hand when I built a PC in 2020 and equipped it with RGB Fans where the LEDs started to malfunction after about a year. Then there is the wireless headset where the already abysmally low range got reduced even more after a firmware update.
The only positive experience I had with Corsair is their keyboards (K100) and the things that dont do anything like their headset stand or mousepad
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ryanizleee
Got myself a Corsair 4000D in the past, then upgraded to the 7000D which was dirt cheap at the time of purchase (great quality if I'm being honest) and also a few RAM sticks.
Not even bothered with their other products, especially their new fans.
Extremely overpriced, especially when they sell them in different packagings like the starter kits and expansion kits($55 per fan with no cables included). And no reverse fans. Great way to milk every single penny out of consumers.
I understand these are premium fans, but there are other companies out there who sells premium fans that does more than Corsair's.
And they blame GTA, what a joke.
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Got myself a Corsair 4000D in the past, then upgraded to the 7000D which was dirt cheap at the time of purchase (great quality if I'm being honest) and also a few RAM sticks.
Not even bothered with their other products, especially their new fans.
Extremely overpriced, especially when they sell them in different packagings like the starter kits and expansion kits($55 per fan with no cables included). And no reverse fans. Great way to milk every single penny out of consumers.
I understand these are premium fans, but there are other companies out there who sells premium fans that does more than Corsair's.
And they blame GTA, what a joke.
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justiful9215
Corsair will never be able to compete with products that don't force proprietary malware software on consumers. Razer and corsair are products that most gamers often try, realize they hate the eco-system and software, and never go back.
Also, corsair default fan profiles and AIO profiles are intentionally obnoxious. They force you to download the software or suffer a default profile which is at the higher performance settings. When you use it default you can hear the fans and pump just browsing the internet. The moment the software is installed it defaults to the balanced profile and the sound levels drop off a cliff.
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Corsair will never be able to compete with products that don't force proprietary malware software on consumers. Razer and corsair are products that most gamers often try, realize they hate the eco-system and software, and never go back.
Also, corsair default fan profiles and AIO profiles are intentionally obnoxious. They force you to download the software or suffer a default profile which is at the higher performance settings. When you use it default you can hear the fans and pump just browsing the internet. The moment the software is installed it defaults to the balanced profile and the sound levels drop off a cliff.
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undeadsquidjj
Steve and all of GN. I have been a long time viewer and a life long gamer/PC enthusiast. The first 2 PC builds I have done for myself had been stolen. After my last PC was stolen, my long time girlfriend and her brother helped me piece together used PC parts to build a very budget friendly PC mostly through donated and second hand personally refurbished components. The GPU I'm currently using (12 year old daily used GTX 980ti) the cooling and card itself are failing and I cannot replace it with all of my money going towards rent, car insurance, and food. Please donate ANY GPU PLEASE
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Steve and all of GN. I have been a long time viewer and a life long gamer/PC enthusiast. The first 2 PC builds I have done for myself had been stolen. After my last PC was stolen, my long time girlfriend and her brother helped me piece together used PC parts to build a very budget friendly PC mostly through donated and second hand personally refurbished components. The GPU I'm currently using (12 year old daily used GTX 980ti) the cooling and card itself are failing and I cannot replace it with all of my money going towards rent, car insurance, and food. Please donate ANY GPU PLEASE
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CASIOMAN20
OK, so on the previous video, i shared that my defective 2022 13900kf tray cpu was rejected RMA by intel support (around 6 - 8 months ago)
Today, i went to the store. i bought it from.
I told them the story and they asked one question, is it 2022 or later After clarifying it was indeed 2022.
They immediately gave me a box version 13900k (not kf)
Honestly, I was shocked!
I went there expecting to hear NO and got an amazing YES
So overall, I am now happy, i suggest everyone use tray CPU and suspect it's defective to go to the store and try RMA it ASAP.
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OK, so on the previous video, i shared that my defective 2022 13900kf tray cpu was rejected RMA by intel support (around 6 - 8 months ago)
Today, i went to the store. i bought it from.
I told them the story and they asked one question, is it 2022 or later After clarifying it was indeed 2022.
They immediately gave me a box version 13900k (not kf)
Honestly, I was shocked!
I went there expecting to hear NO and got an amazing YES
So overall, I am now happy, i suggest everyone use tray CPU and suspect it's defective to go to the store and try RMA it ASAP.
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gamersnexus
The TBPG5HX is an interesting device, but at $1999, you are basically buying two really overpriced devices, and the Tab portion has a really dated chip in it (Snapdragon 8 Gen 4 just showed up on Geekbench with 30% better performance than the Gen 3 and dumped massive GPU gains)... I mean, at that point, you are probably better off going with a Minisforum V3 and a Oneplus Pad 2 separately, which each have much better overall performance separately, and save about $500 in the process! Our wait for a tablet with Strix Point and an Android with Snapdragon 8 Gen 4...
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The TBPG5HX is an interesting device, but at $1999, you are basically buying two really overpriced devices, and the Tab portion has a really dated chip in it (Snapdragon 8 Gen 4 just showed up on Geekbench with 30% better performance than the Gen 3 and dumped massive GPU gains)... I mean, at that point, you are probably better off going with a Minisforum V3 and a Oneplus Pad 2 separately, which each have much better overall performance separately, and save about $500 in the process! Our wait for a tablet with Strix Point and an Android with Snapdragon 8 Gen 4...
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KungFuIsland
The Lenovo Hybrid laptop looks interesting, but only worry is their driver support. I still have a Yoga C930 and the hardware has been going strong for years, but Windows broke and incompatible power settings at the bios level have made the fingerprint driver not wake up from sleep. Even registry edits can't fix it. On top of that there's been a known audio renderer issue on the device that occasionally crashes the audio driver when streaming video. Overall good devices, but running two OS with lackluster driver support could be a nightmare in the long term.
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The Lenovo Hybrid laptop looks interesting, but only worry is their driver support. I still have a Yoga C930 and the hardware has been going strong for years, but Windows broke and incompatible power settings at the bios level have made the fingerprint driver not wake up from sleep. Even registry edits can't fix it. On top of that there's been a known audio renderer issue on the device that occasionally crashes the audio driver when streaming video. Overall good devices, but running two OS with lackluster driver support could be a nightmare in the long term.
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Rangerthelonewolf
Corsair got cocky with how good their marketing team is. Their products aren’t matching the price for quality. And ever since Nvidia GPUs were sold as msrp only to bots, and over charged by resellers by 100% and dumb consumers bought it. They figured hey, they’ll pay 100% more for GPUs, we’ll bump our cost too! Speculation of course. But how they can charge a lot more for average range products when lesser known/marketed pc hardware company’s can make better and cheaper products. Yeah they may wanna dial back the pr/marketing cost.
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Corsair got cocky with how good their marketing team is. Their products aren’t matching the price for quality. And ever since Nvidia GPUs were sold as msrp only to bots, and over charged by resellers by 100% and dumb consumers bought it. They figured hey, they’ll pay 100% more for GPUs, we’ll bump our cost too! Speculation of course. But how they can charge a lot more for average range products when lesser known/marketed pc hardware company’s can make better and cheaper products. Yeah they may wanna dial back the pr/marketing cost.
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bitmau5
Maybe it's just me, but ever since EVGA left the competitive scene, it's just been downhill since. Not factually correlated, my source (aka me), made it tf up... just saying that if more competition was in the room, maybe, just MAYBE we wouldn't have to deal with this bs. I dumped all my NASDAQ bags a while ago and while not many of you folks here are stonk enjoyers, you can still dump on tech in the form of a T-Bag and stop opening your wallets for a year. fk 'em, fk 'em all. Force the market to change into the change that you want to see.
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Maybe it's just me, but ever since EVGA left the competitive scene, it's just been downhill since. Not factually correlated, my source (aka me), made it tf up... just saying that if more competition was in the room, maybe, just MAYBE we wouldn't have to deal with this bs. I dumped all my NASDAQ bags a while ago and while not many of you folks here are stonk enjoyers, you can still dump on tech in the form of a T-Bag and stop opening your wallets for a year. fk 'em, fk 'em all. Force the market to change into the change that you want to see.
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joeapp5774
Well, I guess this explains why Corsair hasn't provided Vengeance PC owners with any crucial BIOS updates, including those containing Intel's microcode for 13th & 14th gen CPUs. They'll probably fire 90% their customer service and tech support people now, because that's what all these companies seemingly do when they start hemorrhaging money. Note to self: Never buy a pre-built PC again. Second note to self: If unable to accede to the demands of the first note, at least make sure the pre-built PC you buy doesn't use proprietary BIOS.
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Well, I guess this explains why Corsair hasn't provided Vengeance PC owners with any crucial BIOS updates, including those containing Intel's microcode for 13th & 14th gen CPUs. They'll probably fire 90% their customer service and tech support people now, because that's what all these companies seemingly do when they start hemorrhaging money. Note to self: Never buy a pre-built PC again. Second note to self: If unable to accede to the demands of the first note, at least make sure the pre-built PC you buy doesn't use proprietary BIOS.
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SteveK6578
Hey Steve, you're the best journalist out there and I know you're trying to create informative and entertaining content, but I think you significantly misrepresented that earnings call. Thankfully you played it for the audience, but portraying what he said as blaming GTA for the entirety of their issues is misrepresenting what he said. I think you know that (given the quality and calibur of your work) and I'm sure you were leaning more towards entertainment on that.... but I felt like this was a giant and unfair leap.
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Hey Steve, you're the best journalist out there and I know you're trying to create informative and entertaining content, but I think you significantly misrepresented that earnings call. Thankfully you played it for the audience, but portraying what he said as blaming GTA for the entirety of their issues is misrepresenting what he said. I think you know that (given the quality and calibur of your work) and I'm sure you were leaning more towards entertainment on that.... but I felt like this was a giant and unfair leap.
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RastaSzopen
Be Quiet! is my favourite brand using safe route to establish brand. Their cases and fans have nothing excessive, flashy or new fads. Everything I have from them (case, air cooler and fans) are just plain black.. In case I have rgb with seperate button on case.
They do exceptionally well how every part is manufactured and feel. Simple looks and functionality are priority.
Corsair if want to do safe route should look up to them...unfortunately I associate brand already with flashy rgb and gaming accessories.
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Be Quiet! is my favourite brand using safe route to establish brand. Their cases and fans have nothing excessive, flashy or new fads. Everything I have from them (case, air cooler and fans) are just plain black.. In case I have rgb with seperate button on case.
They do exceptionally well how every part is manufactured and feel. Simple looks and functionality are priority.
Corsair if want to do safe route should look up to them...unfortunately I associate brand already with flashy rgb and gaming accessories.
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BlueHound
x86 is too complex. It has decades of new features and instructions from both Intel and AMD which must be supported forever. Testing everything in conjunction with all the hardware SKUs and motherboard configurations is simply not possible. AMD today announced a similar massive vulnerability which has been around for many years. ARM, on the other hand, has been designed to be simple and remain that way. It had the same Spectre type vulnerabilities as every other CPU but few (any) ARM only flaws.
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x86 is too complex. It has decades of new features and instructions from both Intel and AMD which must be supported forever. Testing everything in conjunction with all the hardware SKUs and motherboard configurations is simply not possible. AMD today announced a similar massive vulnerability which has been around for many years. ARM, on the other hand, has been designed to be simple and remain that way. It had the same Spectre type vulnerabilities as every other CPU but few (any) ARM only flaws.
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Superfluous.
The GPU refresh cycles increased from 18-24 months to 24-30 months precisely because they're expensive. Way too expensive.
There comes a point in price vs performance where it's not worth upgrading anymore.
Why would anyone spend 800 on a GPU for an increase of 20 fps when they can just lower one of the settings - shadows/reflections/RT - in any game from ultra to very high and achieve the same result without any noticeable visual changes while gaming
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The GPU refresh cycles increased from 18-24 months to 24-30 months precisely because they're expensive. Way too expensive.
There comes a point in price vs performance where it's not worth upgrading anymore.
Why would anyone spend 800 on a GPU for an increase of 20 fps when they can just lower one of the settings - shadows/reflections/RT - in any game from ultra to very high and achieve the same result without any noticeable visual changes while gaming
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TheXev
Corsair may not like it, but they have become a Premium brand, and when people start cutting cost, they'll start with the kinds of parts Corsair makes. Corsair's RAM kits are vastly overpriced compared to more competitive G. Skill kits, anything Corsair makes cooling wise is VASTLY over priced compared to the competition! I think Corsair makes quality products, but often times there is a better deal to be had from an equally reputable brand.
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Corsair may not like it, but they have become a Premium brand, and when people start cutting cost, they'll start with the kinds of parts Corsair makes. Corsair's RAM kits are vastly overpriced compared to more competitive G. Skill kits, anything Corsair makes cooling wise is VASTLY over priced compared to the competition! I think Corsair makes quality products, but often times there is a better deal to be had from an equally reputable brand.
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gamersnexus
Game Informer shut down in no small part because the industry shuns original thought or criticality: see Hollywood. In 2024 no unbiased unbought opinions are allowed to be officially printed or put up on industry-backed industry-owned Review sites(see Rotten Tomatoes). Just like Rotten Tomatoes, nothing real can be left up because it would then affect the profits of the owners of the industry.
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Game Informer shut down in no small part because the industry shuns original thought or criticality: see Hollywood. In 2024 no unbiased unbought opinions are allowed to be officially printed or put up on industry-backed industry-owned Review sites(see Rotten Tomatoes). Just like Rotten Tomatoes, nothing real can be left up because it would then affect the profits of the owners of the industry.
reply
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