Should You Train to Failure (THE ANSWER)
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Date: 2022-04-22
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Comments and reviews: 10
Siberius
(Edit: I disagree. Needs an update I reckon.
So he advocates going as far as you possibly can.
I don't know which is better. Seems going to mega-failure can trash the muscle beyond what is necessary. So stopping a rep or 2 shy, gets the same benefits, without unnecessary damage.
I think there were some papers on this. Would be cool to see an updated video on this from Jeff.
Edit: Yea check out Jeff Nippard's video titled:
-Effective Reps: Does Training To Failure Matter For Muscle Growth? - Science Explained-
From the papers we have so far, it seems to either make no difference, OR, stopping just shy might give you more muscle growth. So this video doesn't seem to be going with the current scientific consensus.
Something to remember is that you still need to sometimes calibrate just what your real max is. Sometimes you can surprise yourself with how many more you can pump out. Definitely don't wanna unintentionally slack off.
As far as high reps. yea go to failure. That's just a different type of failure. The burn.
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(Edit: I disagree. Needs an update I reckon.
So he advocates going as far as you possibly can.
I don't know which is better. Seems going to mega-failure can trash the muscle beyond what is necessary. So stopping a rep or 2 shy, gets the same benefits, without unnecessary damage.
I think there were some papers on this. Would be cool to see an updated video on this from Jeff.
Edit: Yea check out Jeff Nippard's video titled:
-Effective Reps: Does Training To Failure Matter For Muscle Growth? - Science Explained-
From the papers we have so far, it seems to either make no difference, OR, stopping just shy might give you more muscle growth. So this video doesn't seem to be going with the current scientific consensus.
Something to remember is that you still need to sometimes calibrate just what your real max is. Sometimes you can surprise yourself with how many more you can pump out. Definitely don't wanna unintentionally slack off.
As far as high reps. yea go to failure. That's just a different type of failure. The burn.
reply
Rise_And_Reborn
This got me interested in going to the gym again.
I always wanted to train to failure to bring that challenge and mental toughness to my workout, but either people would say no with weak, unsatisfying arguments ( to let themselves off the hook most likely) or I would injure myself because I only trained till failure of tolerance ( not knowing any other types of failure at the time) because I was well past failure to maintain form, so injuries occur because of bad form. Same with explosive excercises, I didnt get the results I wanted because I trained till failure of tolerance while getting slower and less explosive instead of training for failure of tempo while keeping it quick and explosive.
Thanks Athlean!
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This got me interested in going to the gym again.
I always wanted to train to failure to bring that challenge and mental toughness to my workout, but either people would say no with weak, unsatisfying arguments ( to let themselves off the hook most likely) or I would injure myself because I only trained till failure of tolerance ( not knowing any other types of failure at the time) because I was well past failure to maintain form, so injuries occur because of bad form. Same with explosive excercises, I didnt get the results I wanted because I trained till failure of tolerance while getting slower and less explosive instead of training for failure of tempo while keeping it quick and explosive.
Thanks Athlean!
reply
Billy
I have a question about DOMS. As a newbie lifter, the muscle soreness I experience the day after a workout can be excruciating. I imagine this is often what deters people from achieving their fitness goals, but I don't plan on quitting. I know that the effects of DOMS subside naturally and after a few days your muscles return to full functionality and you're able to hit the gym again - but in the long term, do the effects of DOMS become less intense and easier to handle as you become stronger? Or do bodybuilders always experience the same degree of pain after a session and just learn to live with it?
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I have a question about DOMS. As a newbie lifter, the muscle soreness I experience the day after a workout can be excruciating. I imagine this is often what deters people from achieving their fitness goals, but I don't plan on quitting. I know that the effects of DOMS subside naturally and after a few days your muscles return to full functionality and you're able to hit the gym again - but in the long term, do the effects of DOMS become less intense and easier to handle as you become stronger? Or do bodybuilders always experience the same degree of pain after a session and just learn to live with it?
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Tara
Thank you for this helpful video. I was watching alot of influencers who talk about lifting super heavy and training to failure, but describe training to failure as super intense, really painful, screaming inside- This is how I seriously injured myself this year. Do you have any recommendations for someone I could talk to or work with? I need to continue training but have limitations that are possibly permanent. I dont want to hire just any coach or personal trainer, that is part of how I became injured in the first place, trying to follow (probably incorrectly) what they taught me. Thanks!
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Thank you for this helpful video. I was watching alot of influencers who talk about lifting super heavy and training to failure, but describe training to failure as super intense, really painful, screaming inside- This is how I seriously injured myself this year. Do you have any recommendations for someone I could talk to or work with? I need to continue training but have limitations that are possibly permanent. I dont want to hire just any coach or personal trainer, that is part of how I became injured in the first place, trying to follow (probably incorrectly) what they taught me. Thanks!
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Samuel
Amazing description! I think this makes perfect sense considering some people are either low/high reps and high/low weights > it depends on the type of failure you're going after! I recently saw some really expensive band-bar system claiming that it built strength but I've never seen anyone build the kind of strength/physique that free weights do. So with this explanation of the triad -Tempo - Tolerance - Technique- it seems band systems work Tolerance strength only while free weights work Tempo & Technique strengths which give the muscle.
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Amazing description! I think this makes perfect sense considering some people are either low/high reps and high/low weights > it depends on the type of failure you're going after! I recently saw some really expensive band-bar system claiming that it built strength but I've never seen anyone build the kind of strength/physique that free weights do. So with this explanation of the triad -Tempo - Tolerance - Technique- it seems band systems work Tolerance strength only while free weights work Tempo & Technique strengths which give the muscle.
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mahesh
Hi Jeff, a few thoughts on this.
If I try doing an exercise until absolute failure, the first thing that should give in would be the tempo, followed by tolerance followed by technique. Is this correct?
Secondly, I usually try the exercise until tolerance failure > take a couple of deep breaths while holding the weights in the rest position > do another couple of reps until tolerance failure.
Now my goal is to reduce my body fat%. Which tolerance method should I follow to enhance the effect of fat burn?
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Hi Jeff, a few thoughts on this.
If I try doing an exercise until absolute failure, the first thing that should give in would be the tempo, followed by tolerance followed by technique. Is this correct?
Secondly, I usually try the exercise until tolerance failure > take a couple of deep breaths while holding the weights in the rest position > do another couple of reps until tolerance failure.
Now my goal is to reduce my body fat%. Which tolerance method should I follow to enhance the effect of fat burn?
reply
Zetsuke4
whenever I train to failure it would always be by technique/form as soon as my form starts breaking apart or I cant make through full range of motion but for single joint where form is easier like bicep curls I'd do tolerance failure there are barely many exercise where I'll go for this type and then in my conditioning training like sprinting cardio or my power (speed) athletic lifts, failure would be when I cant maintain my max speed.
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whenever I train to failure it would always be by technique/form as soon as my form starts breaking apart or I cant make through full range of motion but for single joint where form is easier like bicep curls I'd do tolerance failure there are barely many exercise where I'll go for this type and then in my conditioning training like sprinting cardio or my power (speed) athletic lifts, failure would be when I cant maintain my max speed.
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James
what about training sub maximal sets all week so I got to the gym do 12 pull ups with some difficulty Jeff does a set to 12 which is failure, the next day i can do another 12 pull ups but Jeff cant because hes beat up from going so hard before so he needs rest, through out the week i hit those 12 pull ups so Monday to Friday I have done 12 x 5 (60) pull ups Jeff has done pull ups 12 x 2(24) who would be better off?
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what about training sub maximal sets all week so I got to the gym do 12 pull ups with some difficulty Jeff does a set to 12 which is failure, the next day i can do another 12 pull ups but Jeff cant because hes beat up from going so hard before so he needs rest, through out the week i hit those 12 pull ups so Monday to Friday I have done 12 x 5 (60) pull ups Jeff has done pull ups 12 x 2(24) who would be better off?
reply
Kirtan
Would be cool to see a debate on the topic between him and Dr. Mike Istraetel. DR. MI is a PhD, pretty good at building muscle and he says that the science shows the opposite of what you say. i. e. 4 RIR (Reps in Reserve) is supposed to be just as effective as 0 RIR. However, he does recommend testing your max every now and then. e. g. go to 0 RIR every 6 weeks to make sure you know what that intensity feels like
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Would be cool to see a debate on the topic between him and Dr. Mike Istraetel. DR. MI is a PhD, pretty good at building muscle and he says that the science shows the opposite of what you say. i. e. 4 RIR (Reps in Reserve) is supposed to be just as effective as 0 RIR. However, he does recommend testing your max every now and then. e. g. go to 0 RIR every 6 weeks to make sure you know what that intensity feels like
reply
David
Experimenting with failure. Today, I tried this for upper chest: incline dumbbells (volume) to failure, then light weight eccentric to failure (3 sets of 8 second movements) to failure, then went to a machine incline and held it, contracted for 3 sets to failure. Holding it had the greatest effect on me, or aleast what I could feel. I'll let you know how I feel tomorrow.
reply
Experimenting with failure. Today, I tried this for upper chest: incline dumbbells (volume) to failure, then light weight eccentric to failure (3 sets of 8 second movements) to failure, then went to a machine incline and held it, contracted for 3 sets to failure. Holding it had the greatest effect on me, or aleast what I could feel. I'll let you know how I feel tomorrow.
reply
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