Billet Labs Monoblock Thermals, Pressure, Laser Scans, & Water Cooling Benchmarks
video description
Thus concluding at 32:32 "Price is the biggest challenge for this. So we think the most suitable user would basically be an ultra-enthusiast who wants this super compact form factor."
AKA the same thing Linus said "It's a cool concept, but unfortunately, I think there are very few buyers for it."
Date: 2024-01-16
Related videos
Comments and reviews: 19
clynesnowtail1257
I questioned the solid mounting kit but I realize why they are doing it. With a card in it its going to be very heavy, maybe even heavier than a NH-D15, although it isnt as tall which does offset that a little. What I do think is maybe the copper rear plate needs to become steel, and they might need a steel reinforcement plate that adds more stiffness to the GPU plate. Copper is pretty soft, you saw deformation from remounts but it might not even be remounts, it probably 'moves' over time on its own just from being under load. I wonder about someone having this on their system for a year, or more, and having CPU temperatures that are degrading the whole time until it starts throttling. They repaste it which cycles all the mounting points and then have the same problem only worse.
Im thinking if you manufactured a steel plate that used the 18() little screws that mount the GPU plate and came out to the existing mounting points. Instead of drilling the GPU plate for countersunk screw heads you'd just drill it through so the screw would pass through to the steel plate. Then the mounting bars would obviously also have to be shortened. But that would prevent the copper from deforming. Another idea which I think may be better and make it cleaner but may increase costs might be to expand the CPU coldplate so it has some extension beyond the body of the water block. 6-8 mm all the way around. Mount a steel plate to this overhang with maybe 4 of the little Allen head flush screws. Those are only there to hold it in place while its not installed. Then this extended steel plate is used to mount to the board. The mounting bars would have to be shortened dramatically in this configuration, and may be too short to use a screw from the top, may end up having to make ones that are threaded on both sides so you clamp it down to the board with a nut.
But, that would apply the load directly to the CPU cold plate, rather than the GPU plate which has significantly more overhang .
reply
I questioned the solid mounting kit but I realize why they are doing it. With a card in it its going to be very heavy, maybe even heavier than a NH-D15, although it isnt as tall which does offset that a little. What I do think is maybe the copper rear plate needs to become steel, and they might need a steel reinforcement plate that adds more stiffness to the GPU plate. Copper is pretty soft, you saw deformation from remounts but it might not even be remounts, it probably 'moves' over time on its own just from being under load. I wonder about someone having this on their system for a year, or more, and having CPU temperatures that are degrading the whole time until it starts throttling. They repaste it which cycles all the mounting points and then have the same problem only worse.
Im thinking if you manufactured a steel plate that used the 18() little screws that mount the GPU plate and came out to the existing mounting points. Instead of drilling the GPU plate for countersunk screw heads you'd just drill it through so the screw would pass through to the steel plate. Then the mounting bars would obviously also have to be shortened. But that would prevent the copper from deforming. Another idea which I think may be better and make it cleaner but may increase costs might be to expand the CPU coldplate so it has some extension beyond the body of the water block. 6-8 mm all the way around. Mount a steel plate to this overhang with maybe 4 of the little Allen head flush screws. Those are only there to hold it in place while its not installed. Then this extended steel plate is used to mount to the board. The mounting bars would have to be shortened dramatically in this configuration, and may be too short to use a screw from the top, may end up having to make ones that are threaded on both sides so you clamp it down to the board with a nut.
But, that would apply the load directly to the CPU cold plate, rather than the GPU plate which has significantly more overhang .
reply
MDxGano
While I'm glad this got a fair chance at an unbiased review, I don't think these guys should be quitting their day jobs for this endeavor unless they are more than safe to just retire comfortably anyways. The quality of copper does not change that it WILL tarnish over time, and will eventually look horrible without some sort of transparent sealant applied to it. This could take weeks or months, but it WILL happen. At $900 plus, it falls into such a niche market that those buying this product are likely doing so out of spite to LTT than anything else.
The form factor is largely negated by the required radiator area to sufficiently cool something like a 4090/13700k system. "BUILD YOUR CASE OUT OF RADIATORS!"...For context, I find water cooling in general a little on the silly side having had 5 aio units fail throughout the years (4 corsiars and 1 coolermaster). My NHU-12S with 2 fans keeps an OC'd 11600k silent under load (150w) and they make a larger version for things like a 13700k to be tamed by. Is a 360 aio rad better Yes, but it is an inconvenient risk I am no longer willing to take when i can have an air cooler literally last forever vs a max of 5 years from aoi pumps based on my experience. Do custom loops have more reliable pumps Also yes, but the all in cost begins to far outweigh the performance benefit if you care at all about money. Some of those builds look absolutely sick, but so do 1100hp skylines being street driven...To each their own and bravo for having disposable income for a hobby.
reply
While I'm glad this got a fair chance at an unbiased review, I don't think these guys should be quitting their day jobs for this endeavor unless they are more than safe to just retire comfortably anyways. The quality of copper does not change that it WILL tarnish over time, and will eventually look horrible without some sort of transparent sealant applied to it. This could take weeks or months, but it WILL happen. At $900 plus, it falls into such a niche market that those buying this product are likely doing so out of spite to LTT than anything else.
The form factor is largely negated by the required radiator area to sufficiently cool something like a 4090/13700k system. "BUILD YOUR CASE OUT OF RADIATORS!"...For context, I find water cooling in general a little on the silly side having had 5 aio units fail throughout the years (4 corsiars and 1 coolermaster). My NHU-12S with 2 fans keeps an OC'd 11600k silent under load (150w) and they make a larger version for things like a 13700k to be tamed by. Is a 360 aio rad better Yes, but it is an inconvenient risk I am no longer willing to take when i can have an air cooler literally last forever vs a max of 5 years from aoi pumps based on my experience. Do custom loops have more reliable pumps Also yes, but the all in cost begins to far outweigh the performance benefit if you care at all about money. Some of those builds look absolutely sick, but so do 1100hp skylines being street driven...To each their own and bravo for having disposable income for a hobby.
reply
andraszoltan2
Wow - this review sgows what can be achieved by small teams of talented individuals, on both counts
Billet Labs clearly know what they're doing, and the speed at which they've iterated this based on the testing outcomes is really impressive. Impressive performance too. I suspect some real commercial interest will come from this - imagine the gaming booths alone that you could build with this!
Anybody thinking about buying can clearly have confidence that they're buying into a relationship, not just buying a product.
I'm an enthusiast (inasmuch as I love gaming and have reasonably deep pockets), but a lazy and disturbingly incompetent one(!), so this is too much hassle for my blood. But, boy, do I love the product: both the idea and the execution.
As for GN, like the Billet GPU block's flatness test; this review is now the reference for the pinnacle of informative, BS-free, entertaining content.
I don't need to be in the market for an ultra-enthusiast innovative monoblock to be riveted to a review. This is like Top Gear for gaming hardware - the editing alone is S-tier, let alone the testing, script and presentation. Well done GN!
And, who knows, as Billet iterate further (AMD variant perhaps to keep with the 'pinnacle' of gaming) I'm hoping they'll bring a future product to match my pocket and laziness!
reply
Wow - this review sgows what can be achieved by small teams of talented individuals, on both counts
Billet Labs clearly know what they're doing, and the speed at which they've iterated this based on the testing outcomes is really impressive. Impressive performance too. I suspect some real commercial interest will come from this - imagine the gaming booths alone that you could build with this!
Anybody thinking about buying can clearly have confidence that they're buying into a relationship, not just buying a product.
I'm an enthusiast (inasmuch as I love gaming and have reasonably deep pockets), but a lazy and disturbingly incompetent one(!), so this is too much hassle for my blood. But, boy, do I love the product: both the idea and the execution.
As for GN, like the Billet GPU block's flatness test; this review is now the reference for the pinnacle of informative, BS-free, entertaining content.
I don't need to be in the market for an ultra-enthusiast innovative monoblock to be riveted to a review. This is like Top Gear for gaming hardware - the editing alone is S-tier, let alone the testing, script and presentation. Well done GN!
And, who knows, as Billet iterate further (AMD variant perhaps to keep with the 'pinnacle' of gaming) I'm hoping they'll bring a future product to match my pocket and laziness!
reply
KiraSlith
Now we've got proper coverage around this thing, I can try to wrap my head around it. None of the various perspectives in my head can quite wrap themselves around this thing, while it doesn't excuse Linus' behavior, it does explain it from my PoV. It's a neat concept, a one-off that relies heavily on a lot of variables either being modifiable or not changing.
It'd be great if the PCIe slot could be on the OTHER side, having this big wide cable doing a loop around the motherboard looks terrible and is a potential riser noise problem, but there's no way to fix that mechanically without just having 2 blocks just due to how GPUs are designed. They could rotate the direction of the water flow to send the water out over the PCIe slot since that's an opening that doesn't involve modifying any motherboards, but the ports would be much harder to reach, pre-attaching pipes means taking phantom guesses at pipe length during assembly, exacerbates shifting risk, and hangs over an area even more sensitive to condensation and leaks. Even just shifting the GPU's position isn't possible. There's strong potential Nvidia will one day release a card with the core too far over on the PCB to fit inside a case built like this again too, so one change later, and it's all over.
reply
Now we've got proper coverage around this thing, I can try to wrap my head around it. None of the various perspectives in my head can quite wrap themselves around this thing, while it doesn't excuse Linus' behavior, it does explain it from my PoV. It's a neat concept, a one-off that relies heavily on a lot of variables either being modifiable or not changing.
It'd be great if the PCIe slot could be on the OTHER side, having this big wide cable doing a loop around the motherboard looks terrible and is a potential riser noise problem, but there's no way to fix that mechanically without just having 2 blocks just due to how GPUs are designed. They could rotate the direction of the water flow to send the water out over the PCIe slot since that's an opening that doesn't involve modifying any motherboards, but the ports would be much harder to reach, pre-attaching pipes means taking phantom guesses at pipe length during assembly, exacerbates shifting risk, and hangs over an area even more sensitive to condensation and leaks. Even just shifting the GPU's position isn't possible. There's strong potential Nvidia will one day release a card with the core too far over on the PCB to fit inside a case built like this again too, so one change later, and it's all over.
reply
xaytana
Assembly-wise, I'd rather see the shared block be the primary piece for all standoffs, leaving the backplates to be literal plates and further held down by a nut. Screws might look nicer but good god the amount of sandwiching makes this an alignment nightmare without the use of alignment tools such as the thin wood rods. If aesthetics are really a concern, a binding barrel, more commonly known as a Chicago screw's nut, could be used, including a spec for a flathead binding barrel to utilize the countersunk hole. Given that all of the toleranced posts are on the block side, and given that the backplates are more or less floating anyways, this binding post solution would be viable, and would make assembly much more streamlined and simplistic, especially as you would now be truly building from the inside out without the addition of alignment tools. Another think that I would personally do, though not entirely necessary at this point, is sink the plastic washers into the blocks slightly, just so that there is a recess they fit into that would otherwise help with alignments; again, not that it's needed, as now the inner core is what's providing posts and threaded rods for assembly alignment.
reply
Assembly-wise, I'd rather see the shared block be the primary piece for all standoffs, leaving the backplates to be literal plates and further held down by a nut. Screws might look nicer but good god the amount of sandwiching makes this an alignment nightmare without the use of alignment tools such as the thin wood rods. If aesthetics are really a concern, a binding barrel, more commonly known as a Chicago screw's nut, could be used, including a spec for a flathead binding barrel to utilize the countersunk hole. Given that all of the toleranced posts are on the block side, and given that the backplates are more or less floating anyways, this binding post solution would be viable, and would make assembly much more streamlined and simplistic, especially as you would now be truly building from the inside out without the addition of alignment tools. Another think that I would personally do, though not entirely necessary at this point, is sink the plastic washers into the blocks slightly, just so that there is a recess they fit into that would otherwise help with alignments; again, not that it's needed, as now the inner core is what's providing posts and threaded rods for assembly alignment.
reply
HankHillspimphand
this to me shows how dirty they got done. no understanding what it was or why it does what it does. just "expensive!!! doesnt work, well i lost the GPU it goes with and it didn't fit another one right but that doesnt matter cuz its expensive and bad based on well I'm linus!" i will never forgive linus off that as he had like 4 points where he could of fixed things and made it right.....he never did until your video. even then made jokes and still doesnt truly get why it was so mean. I'm sure intel gets treated the same....right
its not drama, its not "hate" it my rightful anger for how bad i felt for two guys trying to do something unique. EVEN IF IT DID SUCK(which it doesnt seem to) doesnt matter i know that struggle of being broke and trying to make something to sell from nothing. only to watch that video must of broke thier hearts. i don't care if I'm petty. ask me in 5 years then i might forgive him if he has no more dramas
reply
this to me shows how dirty they got done. no understanding what it was or why it does what it does. just "expensive!!! doesnt work, well i lost the GPU it goes with and it didn't fit another one right but that doesnt matter cuz its expensive and bad based on well I'm linus!" i will never forgive linus off that as he had like 4 points where he could of fixed things and made it right.....he never did until your video. even then made jokes and still doesnt truly get why it was so mean. I'm sure intel gets treated the same....right
its not drama, its not "hate" it my rightful anger for how bad i felt for two guys trying to do something unique. EVEN IF IT DID SUCK(which it doesnt seem to) doesnt matter i know that struggle of being broke and trying to make something to sell from nothing. only to watch that video must of broke thier hearts. i don't care if I'm petty. ask me in 5 years then i might forgive him if he has no more dramas
reply
sam-gk8379
Thanks for the review. The data. is great for comparison as reference. I was lost because of my temps and couldn’t find a definitive answer over internet. I was worried about my temps, but now I am calm that my temps are good, like Alphacool.
My pc spec:
CPU: ryzen 5900x
CPU water block: EKWB Velocity 2
GPU: Nvidia RTX 4090 FE
GPU water block: EKWB Vector2 ABP
RAM: g.skill tridentZ 3600 16-16-16-36 64 GB
RAM water block: ThermalTake Pacific A2 ultra
MB: Gigabyte Aorus master x570s
Pump: Ekwb D5 (speed 50%)
Case: Phanteks NV7
Fan: 12x phanteks D30 120mm(speed 40-60%, controlled by cpu fan header via hub)
Water temp: 32 degrees Celsius max(two hours of gaming)
Gpu temp under load: 56 degrees Celsius(playing games for 2 hours)
GPU hotspot: 61 degrees Celsius (playing games for 2 hours)
RAM DIMMs temp: 39.6 degrees Celsius
all temps read from HWiNFO64
reply
Thanks for the review. The data. is great for comparison as reference. I was lost because of my temps and couldn’t find a definitive answer over internet. I was worried about my temps, but now I am calm that my temps are good, like Alphacool.
My pc spec:
CPU: ryzen 5900x
CPU water block: EKWB Velocity 2
GPU: Nvidia RTX 4090 FE
GPU water block: EKWB Vector2 ABP
RAM: g.skill tridentZ 3600 16-16-16-36 64 GB
RAM water block: ThermalTake Pacific A2 ultra
MB: Gigabyte Aorus master x570s
Pump: Ekwb D5 (speed 50%)
Case: Phanteks NV7
Fan: 12x phanteks D30 120mm(speed 40-60%, controlled by cpu fan header via hub)
Water temp: 32 degrees Celsius max(two hours of gaming)
Gpu temp under load: 56 degrees Celsius(playing games for 2 hours)
GPU hotspot: 61 degrees Celsius (playing games for 2 hours)
RAM DIMMs temp: 39.6 degrees Celsius
all temps read from HWiNFO64
reply
Greg1096
Seems like they are throwing a ton of engineering at a problem that they created themselves, there are other solutions for small form factor without going through all this trouble, no cases exist for this solution so it seems kinda pointless, should take all of the craftsmanship they put into this to come up with a cooler that works with components that are already in production, they need to come up with an actual marketable product so they don't waste all of this free marketing they got from the LTT drama without that no one would even be aware of them.
reply
Seems like they are throwing a ton of engineering at a problem that they created themselves, there are other solutions for small form factor without going through all this trouble, no cases exist for this solution so it seems kinda pointless, should take all of the craftsmanship they put into this to come up with a cooler that works with components that are already in production, they need to come up with an actual marketable product so they don't waste all of this free marketing they got from the LTT drama without that no one would even be aware of them.
reply
JJFX-
Really looking forward to seeing you guys start to do more custom loop testing. Just to note, the US made Optimus cooling are also very good. They have arguably the best CPU blocks available (at least for AM5 in my experience). The company has made some disappointing marketing decisions and I know there were delays getting GPU blocks to people in the past but the quality is phenomenal. There was some recent drama with Roman after he tested their newest AM5 signature block so I'd be very interested to see your results.
reply
Really looking forward to seeing you guys start to do more custom loop testing. Just to note, the US made Optimus cooling are also very good. They have arguably the best CPU blocks available (at least for AM5 in my experience). The company has made some disappointing marketing decisions and I know there were delays getting GPU blocks to people in the past but the quality is phenomenal. There was some recent drama with Roman after he tested their newest AM5 signature block so I'd be very interested to see your results.
reply
FastBowtie388
Just for shiggles and gits.... have you ever considered adjusting the waterflow You can have too much flow and it doesn't allow time for the water to heatsoak and carry the heat away. At a certain point 3 radiators and 9 freaking fans, maybe computer components aren't the answer. Ever consider a plate and fin style (not tube and fin) B&M transmission cooler and a low speed 12volt fan It would be quieter, more efficient, and probably just as reliable. You could still use a PC pump and reservoir.
reply
Just for shiggles and gits.... have you ever considered adjusting the waterflow You can have too much flow and it doesn't allow time for the water to heatsoak and carry the heat away. At a certain point 3 radiators and 9 freaking fans, maybe computer components aren't the answer. Ever consider a plate and fin style (not tube and fin) B&M transmission cooler and a low speed 12volt fan It would be quieter, more efficient, and probably just as reliable. You could still use a PC pump and reservoir.
reply
gamersnexus
It's a cool product, but I'm _really_ curious how much they'd be able to cut down on the costs by reducing the amount of copper used. I get that they're targeting a specific market, but maybe when they become a bigger company they can think about a more mass-produced version that only has copper for the important parts and acrylic everywhere else.
Glad they're getting fair reviews now though, nobody deserves to have their product sabotaged just because someone hates its price.
reply
It's a cool product, but I'm _really_ curious how much they'd be able to cut down on the costs by reducing the amount of copper used. I get that they're targeting a specific market, but maybe when they become a bigger company they can think about a more mass-produced version that only has copper for the important parts and acrylic everywhere else.
Glad they're getting fair reviews now though, nobody deserves to have their product sabotaged just because someone hates its price.
reply
D3Shadow
I give props to you Steve for doing this, but I am most impressed by the guys at Billet for literally fighting tooth and nail for their belief in the product they're pushing and not only believing in it, but pushing out something that marks on your standards as good. The dedication here is actually nothing short of impressive. I wish them the best. They definitely deserve the praise for their hard work & so does GN as a whole for not giving up on them.
reply
I give props to you Steve for doing this, but I am most impressed by the guys at Billet for literally fighting tooth and nail for their belief in the product they're pushing and not only believing in it, but pushing out something that marks on your standards as good. The dedication here is actually nothing short of impressive. I wish them the best. They definitely deserve the praise for their hard work & so does GN as a whole for not giving up on them.
reply
FinxOmally
Nice work Billet Labs!
Interesting to think how much it would have cost Billet Labs to have this level of testing performed, and the potential ramifications if the product didn't perform well.
But they had faith in their product, and with the GN team to tell it as it is.
And it paid off. Really cool to see such a small passionate team output such high level of workmanship. Love to see it.
reply
Nice work Billet Labs!
Interesting to think how much it would have cost Billet Labs to have this level of testing performed, and the potential ramifications if the product didn't perform well.
But they had faith in their product, and with the GN team to tell it as it is.
And it paid off. Really cool to see such a small passionate team output such high level of workmanship. Love to see it.
reply
PK-lk5gs
Thank you for the review, new flatness testing is great and contributes a lot to the details.
I have a question, don't remember it being mentioned in the review: what are you using for the coolant It is not distilled water, is it Usually coolants contain some corrosion inhibitors, therefore it is really strange to see this kind of corrosion developed on the copper surface from this minor leak
reply
Thank you for the review, new flatness testing is great and contributes a lot to the details.
I have a question, don't remember it being mentioned in the review: what are you using for the coolant It is not distilled water, is it Usually coolants contain some corrosion inhibitors, therefore it is really strange to see this kind of corrosion developed on the copper surface from this minor leak
reply
Commander_Aze
so its a 900$ waterblock that is no better than other options that are 1/10th the cost, its highly restrictive in usage, not really pretty, and painful to make simple upgrade to other components later on. All while having a nemesis of corrosive fingerprints.
TLDR No one would buy this unless you are a government contractor with an unlimited budget and limited space
reply
so its a 900$ waterblock that is no better than other options that are 1/10th the cost, its highly restrictive in usage, not really pretty, and painful to make simple upgrade to other components later on. All while having a nemesis of corrosive fingerprints.
TLDR No one would buy this unless you are a government contractor with an unlimited budget and limited space
reply
ColeMarkusen
Glad to see this properly tested. Fun proof of concept but overall way too niche for any sense of practicality. Making it so specific I'm surprised they didn't go all out with a specific motherboard in mind and make a full monoblock to cool the motherboard as well.
I'd love for them to come up with more universal designs. I truly miss universal GPU blocks
reply
Glad to see this properly tested. Fun proof of concept but overall way too niche for any sense of practicality. Making it so specific I'm surprised they didn't go all out with a specific motherboard in mind and make a full monoblock to cool the motherboard as well.
I'd love for them to come up with more universal designs. I truly miss universal GPU blocks
reply
oscarcharliezulu
I love this. Of course their problem is, if it’s any good, some Asian manufacturer will copy it and sell it for like $100. Like the ones that copied thermal grizzly’s cpu mounting plates. For $900, parity with cheaper blocks is a problem.
This design needs to look at area and more importantly water flow and fins acting as conduits.
reply
I love this. Of course their problem is, if it’s any good, some Asian manufacturer will copy it and sell it for like $100. Like the ones that copied thermal grizzly’s cpu mounting plates. For $900, parity with cheaper blocks is a problem.
This design needs to look at area and more importantly water flow and fins acting as conduits.
reply
LeoMajor1
You know seeing the guts of a GPU always is disheartening. It's like wow I paid 999$ on my 3080 for something that looks like it's worth 75$ (I know I'm not paying for appearance and electronics are much more intricate then looks) but it's still so weird to see the GPU chips/board look so..... low tech/minimal
reply
You know seeing the guts of a GPU always is disheartening. It's like wow I paid 999$ on my 3080 for something that looks like it's worth 75$ (I know I'm not paying for appearance and electronics are much more intricate then looks) but it's still so weird to see the GPU chips/board look so..... low tech/minimal
reply
coreyklatt8917
I wonder if the following the torque spec would reduce the deflection over time I feel like it wouldn't if you stop at the torque change like mentioned in the video. I know I have have seen some odd results in my field of work with inconsistent torque values that were still close but not the same.
reply
I wonder if the following the torque spec would reduce the deflection over time I feel like it wouldn't if you stop at the torque change like mentioned in the video. I know I have have seen some odd results in my field of work with inconsistent torque values that were still close but not the same.
reply
Add a review, comment
Other channel videos
