Why Brightness Drops When You Cut Saturation? - HSB vs HSL
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Date: 2022-07-19
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Comments and reviews: 20
Vinicius
If you pause whenever the color picker is on the screen like say at 1: 41, you can imagine the HSL double cone and the HSB cone represented in the main square. It just takes some creativity in folding it with your mind. To imagine the HSL double cone, you pretend that the leftmost black point is moved all the way to the right and the square is no longer a square; it's a right triangle now. You're looking at a slanted representation of a section of the HSL double cone, with all the greys having been moved to this 45-degree diagonal and all the saturated colours sticking out in varying distances from the grey axis. The distance being the saturation of course. Now to view the HSB cone what you do is, instead of moving the leftmost black point all the way to the left, you move the rightmost black point all the way to the left. This cone is not slanted like the other one; it's standing straight and the grey axis is vertical. Another way to go about this entirely is, instead of imagining sections of cones and double cones, just reset and look at the square we started with. Luminance is vertical and goes from the bottom of the square to the top vertically so values are mapped horizontally (i. e. 50% on the vertical scale of grey is the same height as 50% on the vertical scale of any saturated colour, whereas brightness is L-shaped and follows half the perimeter of the square, going from the rightmost black point all the way up and then all the way left to white, so mapping is slanted 45 degrees (i. e. 50% grey on the diagonal scale of grey is the saturated colour on the top right colour because we're tracing lines diagonally.
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If you pause whenever the color picker is on the screen like say at 1: 41, you can imagine the HSL double cone and the HSB cone represented in the main square. It just takes some creativity in folding it with your mind. To imagine the HSL double cone, you pretend that the leftmost black point is moved all the way to the right and the square is no longer a square; it's a right triangle now. You're looking at a slanted representation of a section of the HSL double cone, with all the greys having been moved to this 45-degree diagonal and all the saturated colours sticking out in varying distances from the grey axis. The distance being the saturation of course. Now to view the HSB cone what you do is, instead of moving the leftmost black point all the way to the left, you move the rightmost black point all the way to the left. This cone is not slanted like the other one; it's standing straight and the grey axis is vertical. Another way to go about this entirely is, instead of imagining sections of cones and double cones, just reset and look at the square we started with. Luminance is vertical and goes from the bottom of the square to the top vertically so values are mapped horizontally (i. e. 50% on the vertical scale of grey is the same height as 50% on the vertical scale of any saturated colour, whereas brightness is L-shaped and follows half the perimeter of the square, going from the rightmost black point all the way up and then all the way left to white, so mapping is slanted 45 degrees (i. e. 50% grey on the diagonal scale of grey is the saturated colour on the top right colour because we're tracing lines diagonally.
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Tom
Hi Unmesh, I am posting this here because I cannot find a way to comment on the latest Type Fonts video. I love your videos but not the way the latest one on fonts is displayed. I don't understand what is happening with the video. It is very fast and does not have the normal progress slider so I can look at any portion of the video that I want. Also it is on a rolling screen where it shows other people's videos. I do see where a smaller window is available where I can use the slider but the window is very small. I really think this is a step backward from your normal videos. Tom
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Hi Unmesh, I am posting this here because I cannot find a way to comment on the latest Type Fonts video. I love your videos but not the way the latest one on fonts is displayed. I don't understand what is happening with the video. It is very fast and does not have the normal progress slider so I can look at any portion of the video that I want. Also it is on a rolling screen where it shows other people's videos. I do see where a smaller window is available where I can use the slider but the window is very small. I really think this is a step backward from your normal videos. Tom
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JazzE
Wow. I think a more thorough video will be awesome! Showing some examples in photos and illustrations! :D I can't remember which model I use, I just use whatever is right there in PS by default. Ha ha! But, now that I see it there, that's amazing and still a mite confusing!
So when the brightness is 100%, but I have a somewhat saturated colour, that will end up looking darker because, of course, that colour is darker than white. I'm sure there's WAY more to it, but is that kind of on the right path?
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Wow. I think a more thorough video will be awesome! Showing some examples in photos and illustrations! :D I can't remember which model I use, I just use whatever is right there in PS by default. Ha ha! But, now that I see it there, that's amazing and still a mite confusing!
So when the brightness is 100%, but I have a somewhat saturated colour, that will end up looking darker because, of course, that colour is darker than white. I'm sure there's WAY more to it, but is that kind of on the right path?
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itech
Hi Umesh,
Two subjects I like to hear your story about:
- Good monitor for photo editing only (2K vs 4K, do you need a 4K, colour calibration hardware vs software etc, what is 'good enough' for us enthusiasts.
- Sending of for printing (colour gamut warning, ways to solve it, proofing etc etc, what to ask printer companies.
Again, not overly complex or super expensive. Just 'good enough' for great results. All within a medium budget range.
You know what I mean; -)
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Hi Umesh,
Two subjects I like to hear your story about:
- Good monitor for photo editing only (2K vs 4K, do you need a 4K, colour calibration hardware vs software etc, what is 'good enough' for us enthusiasts.
- Sending of for printing (colour gamut warning, ways to solve it, proofing etc etc, what to ask printer companies.
Again, not overly complex or super expensive. Just 'good enough' for great results. All within a medium budget range.
You know what I mean; -)
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Anubhav
Hello sir, I am currently 17 and learning Photoshop. i am currently working with Photoshop cc 2022. It has been probably a month now and i am at the very basic level. I want to thank you for creating these basic tutorials. I have a question after like giving monthly subscription of Photoshop i was looking for various stock elements and i am not able to find some without purchasing or giving monthly subscription. Is there any way for these. Btw thanks for helping always.
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Hello sir, I am currently 17 and learning Photoshop. i am currently working with Photoshop cc 2022. It has been probably a month now and i am at the very basic level. I want to thank you for creating these basic tutorials. I have a question after like giving monthly subscription of Photoshop i was looking for various stock elements and i am not able to find some without purchasing or giving monthly subscription. Is there any way for these. Btw thanks for helping always.
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Heiko
thank you for this video. The question lingering for me, after having understood the difference, is the purpose of it all. Why do these two models exist? what is the practical usefulness of having these two color representations? and why does Photoshop mix the two up when choosing and checking the values, which in turn lead to this confusion? Thanks and have a great day, Heiko from Germany.
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thank you for this video. The question lingering for me, after having understood the difference, is the purpose of it all. Why do these two models exist? what is the practical usefulness of having these two color representations? and why does Photoshop mix the two up when choosing and checking the values, which in turn lead to this confusion? Thanks and have a great day, Heiko from Germany.
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Kahuna
I have been teaching color theory for a few years, in a physical way, but now that I am starting to teach color in digital media this will help me a lot, I had never considered that difference. Thank you very much Unmesh! I love when you explain theoretical concepts!
Do you have any video that talks about color LAB? In addition to the web you shared, how to use it in Photoshop? Thanks!
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I have been teaching color theory for a few years, in a physical way, but now that I am starting to teach color in digital media this will help me a lot, I had never considered that difference. Thank you very much Unmesh! I love when you explain theoretical concepts!
Do you have any video that talks about color LAB? In addition to the web you shared, how to use it in Photoshop? Thanks!
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Gilson
Thanks for the video, very useful information. Please make dedicated videos explaining which tools use Brightness and Lightness in PS. It seems Hue/Saturation and Desaturate (CMD+Shift+U) uses Brightness, but gradient maps and Blend If uses Lightness. Maybe that information can explain the differences when converting the same image to B&W using the different alternatives.
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Thanks for the video, very useful information. Please make dedicated videos explaining which tools use Brightness and Lightness in PS. It seems Hue/Saturation and Desaturate (CMD+Shift+U) uses Brightness, but gradient maps and Blend If uses Lightness. Maybe that information can explain the differences when converting the same image to B&W using the different alternatives.
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Mark
Wow! Thanks to the Turkish fellow for even catching this and thank you for finding and explaining the answer. First question that comes to mind is could understanding this make a difference in how we might work color on images? The second question is, in converting images between black and white and color, in either direction, does HSB limit the conversion?
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Wow! Thanks to the Turkish fellow for even catching this and thank you for finding and explaining the answer. First question that comes to mind is could understanding this make a difference in how we might work color on images? The second question is, in converting images between black and white and color, in either direction, does HSB limit the conversion?
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qlum
Technically, on a screen the image gets brighter not less bright.
As a display is made up of red green and blue subpixels, fully saturized red would be 100% red color 0% blue %0 in other word the screen produces / lets trough 33. 333% of the light. So the 50% brightness gray is brighter than the original red, even if it may not seem that way.
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Technically, on a screen the image gets brighter not less bright.
As a display is made up of red green and blue subpixels, fully saturized red would be 100% red color 0% blue %0 in other word the screen produces / lets trough 33. 333% of the light. So the 50% brightness gray is brighter than the original red, even if it may not seem that way.
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Tips,
I love all of your videos and the way u talk especially now a days. i was looking for Years for these three things/videos in Ps (1) Save your photoshop life with three history tricks (2) what is overscroll in Photoshop and (3) Disable this for faster retouching in photoshop. Thank You and tons of LOVE from PAKISTAN
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I love all of your videos and the way u talk especially now a days. i was looking for Years for these three things/videos in Ps (1) Save your photoshop life with three history tricks (2) what is overscroll in Photoshop and (3) Disable this for faster retouching in photoshop. Thank You and tons of LOVE from PAKISTAN
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SVS
I dont where this guy goes to find out this information. Its like he has some secret manual he can refer to that no one else has access to.
He also seems to be talking about all these subjects without reading from notes or telepronter.
Very impressive
I couldnt do that even on topics I know inside and out
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I dont where this guy goes to find out this information. Its like he has some secret manual he can refer to that no one else has access to.
He also seems to be talking about all these subjects without reading from notes or telepronter.
Very impressive
I couldnt do that even on topics I know inside and out
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Lord
What would be kinda cool, is a picture that transforms itself into two completly differant ones, if you go back and forth between complet desaturated and color.
Differant Hues can still have the same look in gray, so a picture could evolve into a complet differant one, as soon as it gets more saturation.
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What would be kinda cool, is a picture that transforms itself into two completly differant ones, if you go back and forth between complet desaturated and color.
Differant Hues can still have the same look in gray, so a picture could evolve into a complet differant one, as soon as it gets more saturation.
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Babil
And why was not a circular wheel to be placed in the program in order to match the explanation it provides?
A wheel had to be put if it seemed like this
And why were these two systems set?
If the difference between brightness and lightness is explained, it will be easier to understand more
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And why was not a circular wheel to be placed in the program in order to match the explanation it provides?
A wheel had to be put if it seemed like this
And why were these two systems set?
If the difference between brightness and lightness is explained, it will be easier to understand more
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vivek
Hello Unmesh. Do you have a solution to the overexposed photographs. most of time when we control it either they start looking more contrast or bending starts appears in it. photographs captured in daylight time. . one more thing thanks for sharing knowledge it really helps.
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Hello Unmesh. Do you have a solution to the overexposed photographs. most of time when we control it either they start looking more contrast or bending starts appears in it. photographs captured in daylight time. . one more thing thanks for sharing knowledge it really helps.
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Hadyan
If ling ling can practice for 40 hours a day, Unmesh can make video on the same day as well as edit it on same day and upload it on the same day with best quality of course. Unmesh is ling ling of photoshop.
9: 57 you can see that the date was on 3 May 2: 20 PM.
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If ling ling can practice for 40 hours a day, Unmesh can make video on the same day as well as edit it on same day and upload it on the same day with best quality of course. Unmesh is ling ling of photoshop.
9: 57 you can see that the date was on 3 May 2: 20 PM.
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Peter
Thanks for this video, very interesting. This made me think what's the best (and proper way) of making an image black and white so to retain the values of the colors. Looks as though this adjustment layer is not the way to do it. Could you help with that?
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Thanks for this video, very interesting. This made me think what's the best (and proper way) of making an image black and white so to retain the values of the colors. Looks as though this adjustment layer is not the way to do it. Could you help with that?
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Vivek
Hi Umesh Super good information. Always you are great. I am indian wedding photographer when I edit. cr2 files in Adobe Lrc color bleeding is big problem. How to increase saturation without color bleeding? Please this is a problem for many photographers.
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Hi Umesh Super good information. Always you are great. I am indian wedding photographer when I edit. cr2 files in Adobe Lrc color bleeding is big problem. How to increase saturation without color bleeding? Please this is a problem for many photographers.
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Vladimir
Hello. Thanks a lot for this outstanding video! I would like to know why do we use HSL adjustment instead of HSB(V) or is there any HSB adjustment? And by the way. is there any way to adjust the saturation using curves? THANKS!
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Hello. Thanks a lot for this outstanding video! I would like to know why do we use HSL adjustment instead of HSB(V) or is there any HSB adjustment? And by the way. is there any way to adjust the saturation using curves? THANKS!
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S.
How about a discussion of Exposure/Gamma? Using curves is pretty subjective. Its easier to be more objective or consistent using E/G. Admittedly that does not necessarily mean that it is better, just more repeatable.
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How about a discussion of Exposure/Gamma? Using curves is pretty subjective. Its easier to be more objective or consistent using E/G. Admittedly that does not necessarily mean that it is better, just more repeatable.
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