E-ATX Is A Lie: How Motherboard Makers Ruined Form Factors
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Date: 2020-05-06
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Comments and reviews: 10
Calvin
I just wish AMD would hurry up and fully murder intel. This all comes from intel and their obsession with making anything that touches their hardware wholly custom and unusable with anything else at all. It started with sockets (sometimes switching dyes with the exact same hardware as the socket before)and we saw them attempt to make a new form factor in 2004 as you stated in the begining. This apple style of thinking is precisley why us hobby PC builders avoid apple to begin with! I just pray this new wave of anti chinese products doesnt some how supercharge the greedy nature of american hardware companies. While i hate china more than almost anything i hate apple more and there is somthing to be said about china's flippant ignoring of copywrite laws, while america is so obsessed with them they make everything custom proprietary bs.
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I just wish AMD would hurry up and fully murder intel. This all comes from intel and their obsession with making anything that touches their hardware wholly custom and unusable with anything else at all. It started with sockets (sometimes switching dyes with the exact same hardware as the socket before)and we saw them attempt to make a new form factor in 2004 as you stated in the begining. This apple style of thinking is precisley why us hobby PC builders avoid apple to begin with! I just pray this new wave of anti chinese products doesnt some how supercharge the greedy nature of american hardware companies. While i hate china more than almost anything i hate apple more and there is somthing to be said about china's flippant ignoring of copywrite laws, while america is so obsessed with them they make everything custom proprietary bs.
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Davy
Steve - WOW, this is amazing, and I/we were never aware of the mess the MoBo and case vendors got us into! What on Earth are/were they thinking. Cudos for bringing it to our/their attention, athough they, surely, must know the mess that they're instigating. I always believed, as no doubt many would, that E-ATX WAS a STANDARD, like ATX is. Can we blame SSI for this mess? Why don't THEY do something to clear this up and publish it AS a Standard? If one bought a, say, ASUS E-ATX board and an ASUS Case, would it fit? I mirror your frustration with the manufacturers - let's hope this video will make them be aware of the crap they're doing. I look forward to an update when/if any of them resond to this or your emails to them.
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Steve - WOW, this is amazing, and I/we were never aware of the mess the MoBo and case vendors got us into! What on Earth are/were they thinking. Cudos for bringing it to our/their attention, athough they, surely, must know the mess that they're instigating. I always believed, as no doubt many would, that E-ATX WAS a STANDARD, like ATX is. Can we blame SSI for this mess? Why don't THEY do something to clear this up and publish it AS a Standard? If one bought a, say, ASUS E-ATX board and an ASUS Case, would it fit? I mirror your frustration with the manufacturers - let's hope this video will make them be aware of the crap they're doing. I look forward to an update when/if any of them resond to this or your emails to them.
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Jeffrey
I'm sure I'm not the first person to point this out, but E-ATX is a thing. The dimensions are 12 in. by 13 in. If motherboard manufacturers are misusing the name, that does not mean it isn't a valid spec. It would just mean they aren't following the spec. Also, it appears that most or all of the motherboard's sold as E-ATX in fact are larger than ATX, but smaller than actual E-ATX. This would make them compatible with any case that will fit a proper E-ATX. It's hard to tell from your video, but from all the facts presented it feels like you have a complaint with case manufacturers. Not motherboard manufacturers.
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I'm sure I'm not the first person to point this out, but E-ATX is a thing. The dimensions are 12 in. by 13 in. If motherboard manufacturers are misusing the name, that does not mean it isn't a valid spec. It would just mean they aren't following the spec. Also, it appears that most or all of the motherboard's sold as E-ATX in fact are larger than ATX, but smaller than actual E-ATX. This would make them compatible with any case that will fit a proper E-ATX. It's hard to tell from your video, but from all the facts presented it feels like you have a complaint with case manufacturers. Not motherboard manufacturers.
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Smug
What if we made a new standard and called it AT2X? Advanced Technology Twice eXtended. Or maybe you could spell it ATIIX, to be even more confusing. Then we should follow the example of SSD manufacturers, and explore explore the possibilities of 3D stacking, and create ATX3D, a cube made of six ATX motherboards. Of course, the PSU goes inside the cube. And when quantum computing technology gets there, we could have an ATX board that may or may not change into a microATX while you're not looking. The possibilities are endless!
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What if we made a new standard and called it AT2X? Advanced Technology Twice eXtended. Or maybe you could spell it ATIIX, to be even more confusing. Then we should follow the example of SSD manufacturers, and explore explore the possibilities of 3D stacking, and create ATX3D, a cube made of six ATX motherboards. Of course, the PSU goes inside the cube. And when quantum computing technology gets there, we could have an ATX board that may or may not change into a microATX while you're not looking. The possibilities are endless!
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taiiat
i think it's obvious that it's all a mess. so to the Industry as a whole i can only say that. whether for my own use or when making recommendations to others, i avoid Boards larger than ATX whenever possible because i know it's all a shit show and i'd rather just not deal with it if i can. let me repeat that - i don't buy any of these Products and generally recommend others away from these Products for the same reasons. if you want these larger than ATX Boards to sell more, have some goddamn standards.
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i think it's obvious that it's all a mess. so to the Industry as a whole i can only say that. whether for my own use or when making recommendations to others, i avoid Boards larger than ATX whenever possible because i know it's all a shit show and i'd rather just not deal with it if i can. let me repeat that - i don't buy any of these Products and generally recommend others away from these Products for the same reasons. if you want these larger than ATX Boards to sell more, have some goddamn standards.
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Bill
For many years, I used large dual Xeon boards in my desktops, and that required very careful case selection since most are EE-ATX or some weird proprietary tweak thereof. I always looked at the manuals to see exactly how much space was available, and to gauge how much dremeling and drilling would be required. At the time, it made sense, but Zen 2 finally brought workstation power to plain old ATX sized boards, and I can finally rock nice looking cases again. E-ATX and EE-ATX can die in a fire.
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For many years, I used large dual Xeon boards in my desktops, and that required very careful case selection since most are EE-ATX or some weird proprietary tweak thereof. I always looked at the manuals to see exactly how much space was available, and to gauge how much dremeling and drilling would be required. At the time, it made sense, but Zen 2 finally brought workstation power to plain old ATX sized boards, and I can finally rock nice looking cases again. E-ATX and EE-ATX can die in a fire.
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dismuter
In your conclusion you say they should go all the way to EEB if they need more than ATX. I disagree, it's too large for what the vast majority of high-end motherboards need. CEB is slightly too short too. I think there should be a proper XL-ATX standard that is 13 x11 (HxW, 33x28cm, providing an additional PCI slot to have quad x16 double height PCI-E card support. ATX specifies the first slot too high to leave enough room for the VRMs and DIMM slots on HEDT motherboards.
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In your conclusion you say they should go all the way to EEB if they need more than ATX. I disagree, it's too large for what the vast majority of high-end motherboards need. CEB is slightly too short too. I think there should be a proper XL-ATX standard that is 13 x11 (HxW, 33x28cm, providing an additional PCI slot to have quad x16 double height PCI-E card support. ATX specifies the first slot too high to leave enough room for the VRMs and DIMM slots on HEDT motherboards.
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Todd
I use a laptop plugged into my TV. Does anyone use oversized motherboards? Or is that now common to get larger than ATX? It's kind of understandable that manufacturers don't want to be forced into a standard. Then they can make it as big as it needs to be, as long as they know buyers can find a case for it. But then they should say non-standard and give the dimensions. Then someone is going to label a board NS for non-standard.
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I use a laptop plugged into my TV. Does anyone use oversized motherboards? Or is that now common to get larger than ATX? It's kind of understandable that manufacturers don't want to be forced into a standard. Then they can make it as big as it needs to be, as long as they know buyers can find a case for it. But then they should say non-standard and give the dimensions. Then someone is going to label a board NS for non-standard.
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Hajheer
I got a used dual socket server board and it took a while before I realized not all E-ATX cases are created equal, I knew the mounting hole positions should be the same but when I searched for cases, I realized how vague E-ATX really is, eventually realized I have to find cases that specifically mention ssi eeb to be sure I wouldn't have to return it and settled for phanteks enthoo pro but the search was brutal
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I got a used dual socket server board and it took a while before I realized not all E-ATX cases are created equal, I knew the mounting hole positions should be the same but when I searched for cases, I realized how vague E-ATX really is, eventually realized I have to find cases that specifically mention ssi eeb to be sure I wouldn't have to return it and settled for phanteks enthoo pro but the search was brutal
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Mark
As someone who has struggled against this since I started buying Dual Athlon MP motherboards in the mid 2000's you've voiced every piece of anger I've ever had. I've probably had 3-4 motherboard purchases that have required case changes due to the damn motherboard not fitting when the specs said it should. Most recent one was an Asus X399 board, so still happening 15 years after I first ran into this problem.
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As someone who has struggled against this since I started buying Dual Athlon MP motherboards in the mid 2000's you've voiced every piece of anger I've ever had. I've probably had 3-4 motherboard purchases that have required case changes due to the damn motherboard not fitting when the specs said it should. Most recent one was an Asus X399 board, so still happening 15 years after I first ran into this problem.
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